Employers not hiring WoW, MMO or FPS gamers
January 3, 2009 at 10:09 am by Ruibo
Believe it or not, some employers frown on gamers, especially those who play FPS titles and MMORPGs. Yes we’re talking about you WoW, CoD, TF2 and CS addicts. The heading is indeed true to some degree, the purpose behind this blog was not to cause waves in the gaming industry, pointing fingers at employers and possible discrimination against a World of Warcraft player, but merely an excerpt from a longer conversation that somehow became blown out of proportion.
A blogger, identified by the name of Tale, re-quotes a conversation clip he wrote in a previous post:
“I met with a recruiter recently (online media industry) and in conversation I happened to mention I’d spent way too much time in the early 2000s playing online games, which I described as “the ones before World of Warcraft” (I went nuts for EQ1, SWG and the start of WoW, but since 2006 I have only put a handful of days into MMOG playing – as opposed to discussing them – I’ve obsessed over bicycles and cycling instead).
“He replied that employers specifically instruct him not to send them World of Warcraft players. He said there is a belief that WoW players cannot give 100 percent because their focus is elsewhere, their sleeping patterns are often not great, etc. I mentioned that some people have written about MMOG leadership experience as a career positive or a way to learn project management skills, and he shook his head. He has been specifically asked to avoid WoW players.”
Although the comment comes from one Australian recruiter during a conversation over lunch, the underlying message is still perfectly clear whether it’s from one person or a handful of company executives: gamers, especially those that dump hours upon hours into MMOGs, tend to be unreliable and unable to put 100 percent into their job–no not the job of leading a raid. One respondent to the blog claimed to conduct interviews and hire/fire employees “all the time,” saying that as long as the games don’t impact performance, he doesn’t really care. The respondent even commented that MMO players were no worse than those that pick up hookers, smoke pot, or sing on the church choir.
“Actually the choir guy was the worst, because the @#$%! kept asking to leave early to make rehearsals. I liked the whoremonger and pothead while the churchmonkey, umm, decided to quit,” added the respondent. He also went on to say that he would rather avoid hiring married people with young children. “If it weren’t illegal, I’d hire the unkempt surly gamer with a neckbeard over the married professional guy with a lovely wife and infant at home any day of the week.”
Do recruiters and employers discriminate against certain gamers? It’s certainly possible, especially when a lack of sleep and a lack of focus come into play. There’s an imaginary level of immaturity that comes with game playing, a less-than-serious aura more identifiable with kids and older teens. Many gamers realize this, and would rather not reveal their game playing habits just as porn addicts wouldn’t want to admit their sins to fellow church members. “If I were playing an MMO, I would never let a potential employer or recruiter know about it,” says another respondent to the forum post. “It’s a good red flag for employers, like the GED.”
Could MMO gaming be considered as an addiction? That’s quite possible as well, and if employed gamers show that the only thing on their minds is the next mob raid, and they’re spending valuable time trolling game-related forums, employers will consider the “addiction” as a conflict of priority.
Maybe we'll get back to text-based videogames like Zork now, before trying to paint a video skin on the PLOT.
Why not a "bad Friday, guy died, good Sunday, something about controlling death, life extension, longevity studies, cellular telomere nondegradation"-based government?
upperandlowercase.com
After all, even bunny rabbits and ideologies of fertility, fecundity, got the Sunday part straight..
I am in the transition of leaving MMO's behind in order to focus myself on more important things, namely work and the advancement of a career. It is true that that these types of games can pull you in so deep that you start to prioritize your daily life around them. I just recently noticed and became quite disgusted at how much I was missing just to dedicate myself to a MMO raiding schedule. Work had become less of a priority to me and more of a hassle. I would constantly leave early, my mind always on the game. I would stay up late into the night and be extremely unproductive the next day. While not all gamers are like this, and I respect the ones who can play in moderation, it is very easy to get sucked in and not even realize it. When a game has no end, and each patch and expansion forces you to work harder and harder to achieve unending goals, it is nearly impossible to escape.
It can be tough to quit. The more time you invest, the more powerful you become in the game world, and the more problems you are leaving behind in real life.
The hardest part for me was sticking with it, even though I love to game.
You forget how difficult it made things.
Now THIS is quality link bait.
There you go, mate. Keep as cool as you can. Face piles of trials with smiles. It riles them to believe that you perceive the web they weave. And keep on thinking free.
–The Moody Blues
It is a sad day in hell when in this country the worker is demeaned and treated like so much cattle. Screw the "employers". A general strike by all techs is in order.
What do you get for selling your soul to a corporation? You wind up old, poor, with broken dreams and regrets that you wasted your life trying to please THEM. They have absolutely nol concern for anybody and they will throw you away like used kleenex.
Note that I do not waste my time on video games, prefer to play the guitar. I used to love playing Falcon flight simulator on the old Amiga.
The American dream is a nightmare people. Wake up and seize the time!!!
Now you know what its like to be a pothead. Boohooo.
hahahahahahahahah to true my friend to true.
Actually that's interesting, because about a year and a half ago, I remember reading a few articles about how employers were interested in hiring WoW players who had high rankings/levels, because it somehow demonstrated leadership abilities and the ability to work well in teams. And, how you could now put this sort of thing on your resume. Which I, at the time, thought was a pretty interesting way of someone who probably didn't have a lot of job experience spinning the strengths of what they do spend their time doing for an employers.
Yup, remember that too.
To a certain extent it's true.
WoW players are no fatter, less fit, dumber etc than your average man on the street. It seems easier to target someone tangible like gaming, rather than something like smoking.
There's guys who I work with spend probably minimum of 2.5 hours per day outside smoking. That doesn't often seem to come into the equation.
I can easily understand the hesitation of hiring MMO players, but not FPS players theres a huge difference. Maybe it's just me I hate MMOs (yes I've tried WOW and got to lvl 20) and cound it counteractive tords real life where I could be actually working to earn real money instead of working on a game to earn something that doesent really mean crap to me. In an FPS I can dominate someone which for me is a higher high and it's more of an instant gratification. You win cuz your skilled, not cuz you've unlocked things I haven't yet. Which wow makes it seem you can't enjoy the game till your lvl 70. Why not just let new players start out w/ everything? (Retorical question).
It's true. All WoW players I know are addicts. I used to play WoW and just like everyone else I lost sleep over playing it due to raids, arena teams, and whatever else. The game is designed to make addicts out of people and everyone playing it, like the typical addict, will deny they are addicted. The game is bad for your health, social life (outside the game), and if you become the "elite" in WoW you are taught to treat people like shit. Can't wait for all the addicts to respond to this about how it isn't true. Sorry crackheads, it is.
I call bullshit.
This is no different to not hiring a raging alcoholic. You're allowed to do that, right?
p.s.
I agree 100% with William. Especially the part about fecundity.
I think saying WoW is inherently addictive is just an excuse.
I've played WoW for several years now and rarely do I play more than an hour a day or maybe two-hour blocks on weekends. It took me well over a year to reach 70.
People that say it's not they're fault and that the game is just so addicting are using it as an excuse.
I do think some people develop psychological gaming addictions, but it's a symptom of something else and much rarer than the media would have you believe.
That being said, I'm also a girl and I dated another WoW player (who lived near me) who was a serious raider. I totally understand girls who don't like to date MMO players because they're always playing second fiddle to the game.
Ladies: if you think he likes the game more than you, he probably does. Find a new flame.
Game Addicts basic same as Pot Heads. Losers and Slackers!
"Employers not hiring"…
…I think the Onion "illistrates" the reason why…
'Warcraft' Sequel Lets Gamers Play A Character Playing 'Warcraft'
FYI: As posted at… http://www.theonion.com/content/video/warcraft_se…
…enough said…
Metricula, you are the rare case of a WoW player. Almost everyone plays at least 4-6 hours a day and quite a few play 12+ hours a day. One of my so called "friends" at the time was playing till 6 a.m. and would then go to work with 0-2 hours of sleep. He also claimed the game wasn't a problem, but he wasn't going without sleep before he started the game.
Um, I understand this whole thing. I have never tried WoW, but I used to play runescape. I started when I was 13 or so. And now, 6 years later, I have realised a pattern. I played runescape when I first started maybe a total of 3 hours a week. Over the course of a year, I upped it to an hour a day. It eventually got boring, so I stopped logging on. About my 16th birthday, I "rediscovered" runescape. I began playing it compulsivly. I had it up to about 4 or more hours a day. 6 months later, it got boring again. I haven't logged on in over 3 years. I have no plans to, because I am going to college, and am trying to hold down a job. If I start again, I may become addicted again. Also, about the GED thing, I dropped out of high school at 14. I couldnt deal with the teachers or the school. And since its the only one that isnt an hours drive away, I started doing internet schooling. I would do a weeks worth of course work in an hour. And because I couldnt spend an hour a day on the thing doing lessons (I finished the year in a month), they wouldnt let me pass. So I got my GED at 15, with 3 perfect scores, 2 years before I would have gotten out of high school. The whole taboo about the GED doesnt make sence to me.
Cris P. Bacon,
If I had to hire someone who said "I couldnt deal with the teachers or the school." why would I want you to come work for me and my own BS? Can't deal with something simple as school, then sorry mate. Try some where else. That's what I think, now.. if your story was different.
"I got a GED, but I have spent a lot of time learning things on my own and have a few years of relevant work experience on top of my peers" that tells me something else… You have the capacity to problem solve and the tenacity to push forward in life. Id hire you then on the spot.
The GED is more of a flag, if you conducted a survey of GED holders now, and five years later… I wonder how many of them have actually flourished in life. A GED at younger years probably means a good deal of adversity ahead, than a GED holder @ 30.. but who has a bachelors degree and has made a name for his/herself.
It's easy for recruiters to use tid bits of information like that to get the best. Sure there maybe a gem in that pile of resumes, but the effort for them to wade through the cruft is too much sometimes.
-JA
Outstanding how you totally misinterpreted the original forum post. Link bait indeed.
That makes no sense.
Time management is one of the most important skills you need to be successful in life/work. If you play online games in general, and is still capable of accomplishments both personally and professionally wise, that means at least you have some basic time management skills.
If you don't get picked out to work somewhere because of your online gaming habits, probably you(gamer) wouldn't feel like the work environment is good for you and that means you are better off not working for such a company. That's probably a place for people that lacks on creativity or forward thinking.
Anyways, doesn't your productivity should be measured by your results to the business?
Omg!! pll you need a life and it is WoW and thier games. Now that you are fat, stupid and most likely ugly you can get a real job or I should ask a living world life.
Good luck ! ?
All people I know that play WoW are addicts.
One of the people in my friend groups even missed New Year's Day party cos of it. He didn't say it but we all knew it. He talks about it all the time. If he starts to befriend a girl, he still only talks about it with her… eventually they get bored of him. He has had no gf all his life (20 years). It's all that is in his mind.
He's in Computing at university… he goes to the university everyday but what does he do? Play WoW with his buds and fail years.
It's sad.
I once was addicted to a TextMMORPG where I had an alliance, and what started as a little fun became and addiction as the alliance grew to the point where it would feel worthless to quit. But than one day… it became so stressing 'cos of in game factors that I managed to get the strength to quit once and for all and leave 300 active people leaderless (I gave it to someone else ASAP but no one was capable). But than I thought… it's only a game, no reason to feel bad. That's my story, played it for about 1-2 years I think. Although I wouldn't seek to go out or arrange things in real life, I would go every time I was invited AND there was an exception which was my gf, she was my only priority bigger than the game. In classes I'd spend the time thinking of strategies…
Isn't the red flag more that WoW or gaming comes up in a job interview than anything else? I've been in my fair share of interviews and I never had video games come up.
Who the hell brings up video games in a job interview? Using video game experience on a resume is DUMB. Bringing in up is DUMB. Admitting that you play anything besides Madden is DUMB.
But seriously, as an ex-WoW addict, a new job is just the sort of thing to break the addiction, as long as its halfway stimulating. What MMO junkies need is something in their life to give them a sense of responsibility and advancement. Once they get that from somewhere besides WoW, the odds are good that they will lose interest in the game completely. Well, that's how it worked with me anyways.
Wow, this is kinda crazy. Good thing I am never good enough at these games to let anyone know about it.
People are forgetting about the over-20 WoW players. We don't all live in our parents' basements-some of us are the parents! I play WoW, am a single dad, never miss work, take care of my house, and do things with my son. I've been playing since the release and I play on my days off and maybe an hour or so (if at all) on the days that I do work. I actually spend less time at it than my dad did puttering around his workshop when I was a kid.
It is possible to balance these things if you keep your perspective. Gaming is to kill time and relax after the work is done just like any other hobby or pastime. True, I may not have the super-geared raiding character, but I really don't care. I do it for me.
The idea that WoW is some sort of deadly, life destroying drug is redonkoulous. The problem is, people invest in the idea that their character is worth something, thus they feel like the time in it is important, and because they have invested so much time they need to invest more time.
It's a game, if I'm not having fun I don't play. Everything in moderation. Some times I'll play a whole day, some times I won't play for weeks. Depends on what I've got time for and how I'm feeling. I certainly don't feel this responsibility to play that many do, well I can't let my guild down gotta raid Molten Core 6 nights a week. I'm not tricked out with Tier 6 armor or whatever but I manage, and have good time doing it.
I've been playing WoW since launch, I too have seen the people around me crumble into little piles of sleepless mass. The odd thing is that the people that I know that have become "addicted" are people that were not traditionally gamers whereas I am. It almost seems as though they didn't really know how to manage games and life having never been exposed to them.
Gotta agree with Alex and Tim right above me. It's awful hard to hold down a full-time job and play WoW 25+ hours a week. Some people do it, but that's ALL they do outside of work.
I'm in my mid-twenties but I played MMOs all through college with no issue, but I know people who flunked out "because" of WoW.
WoW was just an excuse for poor time management.
People want to feel like in-game accomplishment are really important, and they are up to a point. The "responsibility of raiding" is a total loss of perspective. Sure, you want to raid with your friends as much as possible because you're an integral part of the group but if you can only afford to do it a couple nights a week you need to take that into consideration.
"The whole taboo about the GED doesnt make sence to me."
Maybe it would make sense if you spelled it sense instead of sence.
"Who the hell brings up video games in a job interview? Using video game experience on a resume is DUMB. Bringing in up is DUMB. Admitting that you play anything besides Madden is DUMB."
You can't really call other people dumb and then write poorly. You just end up sounding like a fool. "Brining in up is DUMB" Don't you mean bring it up?
As for my opinion of the article I think companies shouldn't be allowed to discriminate against gamers, but it's bound to happen anyway.
^Exactly.
Being a woman of child-bearing age legally shouldn't come up in an interview, but you still find discrimination against that group.
I think quite a few of the people who 'think' they play WoW don't really understand how MMOs work. Playing for 1 hour a day or less is not 'playing' an MMO. It is just killing time. To 'play' an MMO takes multiple hours at a time and requires a long term commitment to the game. You can learn the basics an hour at a time and gradually explore an MMO world at that pace, but you won't be 'playing' the game in any true sense.
As for refusing to hire WoW players, that makes sense for the most part. WoW isn't your typical video game or MMO. It doesn't require skill or intelligence to play. It doesn't require any effort worthy of note. It encourages selfishness and teaches immature people that they can succeed despite their lack of team work, their selfishness and their laziness (since everything can be aquired via leeching other peoples skills).
WoW is also addictive for multiple reasons. There is the simplicity factor that tends to draw in younger players (ones still lacking true education) as well as the people that lack the skills/intelligence/time to succeed in true MMOs. There is the ease of lvling (all the true lvling takes place in the form of gear aquisition at max lvl) designed to hide the true grind. There is a general acceptance of the game amongst non-gamers making it not 'geeky'. All this makes it easy for a majority of casual/non-gamers to get sucked in without realising it.
That said, there is another reason for the addictiveness. Social interaction. Having something game related that even casual/non-gamers will talk about is a big draw to some people. For true gamers WoW can be a kind of stepping stone either as a means to get to know other groups of people or as a means of drawing the casual gamers into more of a true gamer role. In the end though, true gamers will grow tired of WoW fairly fast (under a year) as they will either acomplish everything they feel is worth doing or realise that the effort they put into WoW means nothing in the end. They will often come back though from time to time simply cause they will get lonely when none of the people they have come to know in WoW will try any other games.
This is why so many people get addicted to the game and don't know how to manage their play time. For some it is the ease with which they can feel like they accomplished something major (even though it means nothing since millions beat them to it and did it better+faster). For others it is the social interaction.
Raiding is a combination of both these things. Feeling you have to go raiding on a scheduale is a sign that you are raiding for the wrong reasons. Yes you can get better gear out of raiding, but if you have to attend regularly to get points to purchase these upgrades then you're missing the point of the game. Feeling you have to always be there to help people out is another issue, but if you are raiding properly (ie-for fun) then you should feel comfortable missing raids on occasion and people should understand you can't always be free.
The only time raiding is worthwhile is when it is done for fun and proper social interaction (which in turn is fun). I never have and never will raid purely for the purpose of getting gear for myself. It would drive me nuts and bore me to pieces. I do however enjoy the casual raids my WoW guild does. The fact that we can go into things undergeared and still breeze through them shows how a combination of skill and intelligence is greater than a large time investment (ie-better gear). We also skip the points system (DKP) since we rarely have members to spare anyway (usually takes the whole guild to 10 man). We just give gear to the most needy (even if it is someone we PuGed). This results is better overall stats and a much friendlier atmosphere. If 2 people have equal need of something then they each roll for it. Whoever loses still wins in the sense that a friend got the item and they then know they are gguarenteed it next time.
This is where WoW tends to differ from true MMOs. In most true MMOs high lvls mean something cause they take time and effort and make you work for everything. In WoW lvls mean nothing and skill has little bearing on large group activities (unless attempting something genreally considered too hard based on your gear). With WoW you can get fully geared in under 3 months and without any kind of guild/group. This means that selfish people and people that just want to show off can do so easily(as stupid as boasting about WoW makes them look, which they don't realise since they are lost in their own little world along with many other people). To do this in a true MMO can often take a year or longer with a much larger daily time requirement as well as a need for other people to help. This makes it important (and often necessary) to form bonds with people in order to see your goals reached and in turn helping these people reach their own goals.
If you want an MMO that you use as a means of promoting your skills/intelligence it needs to be something more substantial than WoW. Mind you, if that is your goal in playing a game then you can't use it like that anyway.
Los–I was playing Eve Online until WoTLK and I also spent years before that in Star Wars Galaxies from launch until the NGE.
There's a ton more to do in MMOs to "play" other than end-game raiding content, but I love 95% of what you said.
"Feeling you have to always be there to help people out is another issue, but if you are raiding properly (ie-for fun) then you should feel comfortable missing raids on occasion and people should understand you can’t always be free."
That's some WIN right there. So many people ditch the real world for WoW. Again, it just shows immaturity and poor time management.
And sadly, I can name more than a handful of my friends whose boyfriends would turn down sex in favor of WoW. And they're HOT girls. That's some screwy-priorities in my book, but I'm biased in favor of women.
But I digress.
Back on the topic, has anyone heard WoW players argue about whether or not they should be able to list guild leader experience on a resume? They talk about showing good leadership or teamwork.
If you have so little experience that you feel you need to list WoW as a relevant hobby, maybe you need more experience…
Way I see it, most hardcore FPS players that I have ever met were the definition of immature gamers,
They gain gratification by defeating someone with less skill than them over and over… I love WoW because it gives a fictional sense of doing right (PvP parts set aside)
You get to complete a story and get your anger out on the bad guys,
From what I've seen,you have people from the ages 12-29ish playing FPS, while there is a range from 10-60 in WoW. One allows people of all ages to bond and makes you more diverse in socializing with those of different races, cultures and ages; something useful in management. FPS gives you the ability to gloat, take satisfaction in anothers loss and that you can possibly do anything by yourself.
MMORPG = Good for public relations
FPS = Bad for PR
When contrasting the addiction, I've seen people addicted to both styles of games to the same degree
Well, I can see where it could be a good thing,and a bad thing.
It can show that you can put effort into something, or that you wouldn't be focused on your work. To be on the safeside, I'd just stay a "Closet-Gamer".
I'll be the first to admit that I use computers to get away from people (I hate people), but I have never used WOW to do that. I spend more time hacking Linux than I do playing any game. So, is using a computer to get away a bad thing? NO, it's not.
way to go Timmeh!!
hacking linux = conversation killer
addiction is a matter of personality not which games you play.i play rpg's and fps's and have for 30 odd years. it never stopped me getting a job but then again what i do outside work isnt thier business.